Reflecting on 2023 & Season 2 Teaser

Step into the new year with us! 🎉 In this Season 2 Preview, we rewind to explore the influential ideas and captivating resources that shaped our thinking in the past year. 📚 But that's just the beginning—get ready for a sneak peek into the upcoming season, where we'll be delving into exciting new topics that promise to spark your faith. 🔮Join us on this journey of reflection and anticipation in the Season 2 Preview of Navigating An Ancient Faith. 🚀

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Watch the Biblical Series: Exodus

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Chapters

• 0:00 Value of Reflection
• 5:38 Books that Influenced Us
• 21:30 Biblical Series: Exodus
• 25:55 What We've Been Watching
• 32:02 Season 2 Teaser

Transcript

Season 2 Preview

David: [00:00:00] I actually confess, when you said the warrior princess, I thought you were going to say Xena, the warrior princess. Hey, welcome everyone to season two of the Navigating an Ancient Faith podcast. My name is David, and with me as always is J.R. J.R., you signed on for season two. 

J.R.: Yeah, there we go. Back for season two. I'm excited about this. 

David: Yeah, another season of interesting conversations, at least between you and I, if anyone else.

J.R.: Yeah, I wasn't sure my contract was going to be renewed, but I'm glad that worked out. 

David: Yeah, NAF decided to go ahead and renew your contract and mine too, so. 

J.R.: Man, I got a good agent. That's a benefit. Shout out to him. 

David: Yeah, so season two. This is fun. It's a bit of a milestone. We talked about it at the end of last season, you know, what a milestone it was, 20 episodes, get that season under your belt, and now we're gonna start on season two.

J.R.: Yeah. All right. So where are we taking it? 

David: So today's going to be a bit of an intro roadmap [00:01:00] of where Season 2 is going. We're going to talk about some of the things that we're excited to jump right in and talk about on Season 2. But really we're going to start off by an exercise that I found helpful. And that is just discussing a couple of the resources maybe that you and I have individually found helpful over this past year - calendar year - because we're recording thi, it's the holiday season. So we'll get into that, too, but just the resources that have helped us grow in our thinking. Spiritually, theologically, philosophically, you know, any kind of resource like that.

Just to say, here's what has influenced me over the past year, okay? So we'll have a chance to talk about that. One of the reasons why I think this is helpful is that I have enjoyed looking back and seeing how my own thinking has developed and I think it's one of those things that maybe as a Christian you think, well, this is what the Bible says, this is what I believe, and that shouldn't change.

But I [00:02:00] know I've enjoyed looking back and saying, what I believed five years ago differs from what I believe today. Now, not in the fundamentals, but the whole thinking that shapes the way I read the Bible and my faith. It's different from ten years ago. It's different from twenty years ago, right? 

J.R.: Yeah. Well, it's like you said, that you kind of say, well, shouldn't it remain the same? You know, truth doesn't change, those types of things. But the truth is, you know, we kind of go on a path. I mean, this whole thing's a journey and we see things differently than in any other parts of life.

And so it's no surprise that I view the Bible a little bit differently than when I was 20, certainly, you know. You know, and I think when you grow up in church, you sort of you sacrifice understanding for what obedience, maybe? And this is probably true for any, anything that claims to have to outline morality in any significant way, you know. And maybe I should say that there's a shift from obedience to understanding, not, that I sacrifice one for the other. But [00:03:00] there's kind of a shift, you know, I think about the what is it, the proverb that says, that starts off, that says, "The fear of God is the beginning of wisdom," right?

And I think the key word in that is, you know, you can focus on what fear means and what does it mean to fear God? But I think the key word is, the beginning. Like it's the start of the journey. And it culminates with wisdom. Yeah. Yeah. So, I mean, you know, it kind of goes from fear, which is what a child needs an immature person needs to fear his father because the father's protecting him. But the goal is to kind of move toward what, toward obedience and then toward something like knowledge and then to, you know, to wisdom and really ultimately holiness.

And so it's more of this path that we're on that I like to think of. And so, yes, I've kind of seen that myself. I've seen this shift from obedience - maybe I should say maybe knowledge to wisdom. Maybe I'll give myself a little bit credit, maybe that I'm further along the journey , that it's not merely about knowledge, it's a little bit about applying the [00:04:00] knowledge and the wisdom behind it.

David: Yeah. Yeah. It's, it's slow going, but I'd like to think I'm a little further along in the depth of knowledge and understanding than I was, you know, five or 10 years ago. And <Yeah, no doubt.> yeah. So, yeah, part of that is just saying that's kind of the idea behind this is to reflect back and say, what resources have influenced me? How have I changed in my thinking? And maybe depth is a better way to say that because, you know, at the core of our beliefs, those don't change. But really my understanding of them, the depth of my understanding, the wider application of it. <Yeah.> You know, all that changes and deepens. And so, yeah, it's just a little exercise that I like to do at the beginning of each new year or at the end of a year. But we are in the holiday season, so let me start out by just saying. How's the holiday season progressing? 

J.R.: So far, so good. So far, so good. Yeah, look we'll be catching up with you in Tallahassee. <That's right.> Getting the family together, so that's coming up. And, man, it's always [00:05:00] crazy. I'm glad we take a break during this time because It's just so chaotic. There's work parties and friendsgiving and Thanksgiving and there's so much going on. I can't imagine having to fit in episodes during all this. 

David: Yeah, that's true. 

J.R.: So yeah, and then that's why you get to New Year's and you look back at the last two months and say, man, I've gotten out of shape and I've eaten too much. Same thing with the podcast. Man, we haven't got to get back on track. 

David: Yeah. All my goals went out the window. Yeah, that's why New Year's resolutions. I've got to get back on track. Yeah, exactly. So let's start out by I'll throw it out to you first, okay? So what is you know, both of us like to read and if it's a book or an author or more of an idea, but, you know, I'll throw it out to you first. What's one big thing that has influenced you over this past year? 

J.R.: Man, there's so many of them. I'll tell you what, I think I've mentioned it before in previous podcasts, but The Unseen Realm by Michael Heiser. I've read now a few books of [00:06:00] his Reversing Herman and The Unseen Realm. Those are really, really, it's one of those books that when you get through it, you find yourself for the next several months. It shapes the lens that you view the Bible through. You know, well, to clarify The Unseen Realm is kind of discusses what the hidden supernatural elements throughout the Bible, right? Explores ...

David: Yeah, it's reclaiming the spiritual realm, the supernatural element, throughout the Bible. <Right, yeah, yeah.> And with a proper understanding of how to read it and how to understand it. Yeah. 

J.R.: Right. Yeah. Yeah. And so many times as I was reading this, it kind of challenges, you know, my traditional interpretation sometimes of what I thought verses meant. And he does a great job, he takes a you know, an extremely scholarly approach, and so this is not just one guy's opinion about what Revelation means or something like that.

It's very scholarly. And he, just gave me a new lens to read the Bible, particularly the Old Testament, you know, kind of through this [00:07:00] supernatural context. And it gave me a deeper, a more, you know, that depth that you were talking about: a more deeper, a more nuanced interpretation of scripture. And it helped me kind of grasp a broader spiritual significance of primarily the Old Testament. 

David: Right. Yeah. I would agree with that.

J.R.: It's great, yeah. Have you read, I think you've read The Unseen Realm, right? 

David: Yeah. The Unseen Realm. I just finished Angels and Reversing Herman. That's another, yeah. 

J.R.: Okay. Yeah. 

David: So, yeah, that's what I've ...

J.R.: Demons is on my list. It's downloaded to my Kindle. It's, it's, so there you go. That'll be my 2024 influential book.

David: Right? No, I would agree with that. We kind of read that at the same time. It's funny cause I don't think we said, Hey, you should read this next. But I think we both just kind of are working our way through the books that Heiser has put out. But ... 

J.R.: I'm not sure how I even stumbled across him. I don't know if you brought him up to me or I brought him up to you. I don't know. 

David: I think I brought him up and I, kind of forget how [00:08:00] I came across it. But I just remember that I just got his book and started reading it and I thought man this is great. And I heard on another podcast actually <Yes.> that at that very same time, like within weeks that he had passed away. 

J.R.: Right. Yeah. Yeah. The same thing. So a little bit of a heartbreaking thing. It's like, man, I want to know what this guy has to say. 

David: Like, I just, I just found this guy and he just passed, you know? 

J.R.: He's gone already. <Right. Yeah.> So yeah. So he's been influential and there's other authors, but he kind of sums up the idea of just the lens of how to read the Old Testament. I'll, I'll, I'll say it that way. And of course, you know, our trip to Greece and you know, our trips you know, it started off with Egypt. When did we go to Egypt? It's been 10 years? I don't know, but, but all our travels and things like that. So we started off, we went to Egypt. And you knew a lot about Egyptian mythology. And I remember a conversation that you and I had, and I said, [00:09:00] you know, cause you kept explaining of, this is what this god does. And he takes you to the underworld and through these means and all this kind of stuff.

And I remember saying, man, how, who made this stuff up? You know, I remember having that conversation with you and said, did somebody just, I mean, just pull it out of thin air and said, this is how, you know? And so it started off with understanding a little bit more about Egyptology. And then we went to Greece, I understood more about mythology and started reading a lot about that. And that's when it started to click that it's, it's a way to explain how the world works the best way they knew how through the oral tradition. <Yes.> And when I saw that, it actually helped me read the Bible in a different way.

And so again, Michael Heiser helped that, mythology helped that. So that's sort of like my 2023 journey to kind of the, the shift in the way I read the Bible and you and I were talking the other day about Judges and I think we're going to do a series on that this year. But yeah, I was telling you, man, I can't wait [00:10:00] to read Judges now. When who would have said, I wouldn't have said that in 2022, I'm pretty sure I wouldn't have said that. But yeah, because of this new lens, this idea of what's the deeper meaning behind what I originally kind of understood the surface text to say, you know? And I'm finding all these patterns and all these interesting deeper meanings. So that's sort of my 2023 <Okay> transition.

David: Okay. No, that's interesting. I've been in a similar journey. I would say the concepts that Heiser was writing about was not my first introduction. But the way he wrote about it brought it all together, and it helped me understand that okay, so we take the stories of the Bible at face value. And when you read it that way, it's just, you know, story, this story, this story, this story.

Underlying all that, I think I'm coming to an appreciation that there is a much larger, grander narrative happening in the spiritual realm, <Right.> that is very easy to miss. I guess that's how I would say that. [00:11:00]

J.R.: Right. Yeah, and I mean, look, this year I've really loved reading the Old Testament, and maybe for the first time, you know. I've always kind of avoided the Old Testament, other than obviously Genesis and Exodus, you know, you kind of, that ties into the narrative. But, I don't say I don't read the Old Testament, it's just difficult. It's difficult to fit into the modern New Testament biblical paradigm, right?

<Mm hmm.> Some of this stuff doesn't seem to connect. And so yeah, this year I've really loved reading the Old Testament for the first time. And I have a better understanding of what the Old Testament writers were trying to do. In that they were trying to explain both human nature and spiritual nature. You know, , along with the lineages and histories and things like that, but they really are trying to explain the spiritual realm and human nature through a lot of these stories. <Yeah.> And I'm starting to see this. 

David: Yeah. Yeah. And that opens up the whole Old Testament to you once you start seeing that. Agreed. 

J.R.: Yeah. Yeah. Oh, here's something interesting that I kind of and this ties into an article that I've read, but here's something that I've learned [00:12:00] is that, in the old Testament, there's three major false gods, right? Well, there's several of them, but three major ones Baal, is one of them, you know, you hear a lot of mention of Baal and you hear a lot of mention of Ashtoreth and the third one is Moloch. And you kind of, Baal you worship to sort of achieve prosperity, maybe, you know, he falsely promises freedom over the constraints of morality or, you know, get away from God and he promises freedom, right? And that's sort of the understanding of Baal. 

And then Ashtoreth is also Aphrodite in the Greek mythologies and Venus in the Roman mythologies. And she offers sexual freedom. You know, she kind of opens the door for sexual freedom and if you worship her, that's what you achieve. And then Moloch, who is it ties in with Kronos, you know, he's kind of, yeah, he's the destroyer and, he's the one that people used to sacrifice their children to him, things like that.

<Right. Right.> And, and I understood this through the help of some writings that one [00:13:00]leads to the other, right. You know, you never hear Ashtoreth, you virtually never hear Ashtoreth without talking about Baal. So it's Baal and Ashtoreth, right? And it's because Baal leads to Ashtoreth. And then once you invite those two spiritual deities into your culture the end is destruction, the end is Moloch. And before long, you're sacrificing your children to what sexual freedom to prosperity.

And one one ushers in the next, you know? And so the ultimate end, to allowing Baal and Ashtoreth into your culture is Moloch and you literally give up your children. And I thought about that like if that doesn't overlay our current modern Western culture, then I'm not sure what does. And I've heard all those names before, but I've never heard it all tied together. 

And so it's kind of this to go back to this mythological lens and you tie it into and I won't go down that road about Venus and the warrior princess and things like that. But when you tie it in through [00:14:00] that mythological narrative, you really do see the pattern a lot clearer, that one ushers in the next. And so that's kind of a good example of something I've read in the Old Testament recently that just popped out at me after I have kind of had this understanding of the spiritual realm and how those play out in the physical realm and culture. 

David: Okay, okay. Yeah, so I actually confess, when you said the warrior princess, I thought you were going to say Xena, the warrior princess. I think she comes along later though. 

J.R.: Yeah. I'm not sure where she ties in. That's the videos or that's the TV show that has been influential to you in 2023? You've gone back, rewatched Xena Warrior Princess? 

David: Well, maybe like 1983. But yeah, I don't know when that, I think it was the eighties, right? 

J.R.: It might be nineties. I don't know. 

David: Kevin Sorbo as Hercules and then Xena, Warrior Princess. 

J.R.: Oh, you actually watched it. All I know is just

David: Of course I watched it.

J.R.: commercials. Well, see, that's where you got your foundation of mythology. See, I never watched that. I should have started [00:15:00] back then. 

David: Right. Those shows were much deeper than I actually realized when I was watching them.

J.R.: Well, they actually probably are. 

David: Yeah, they probably are. 

J.R.: Not to give props to Xena, but you know.

David: Well, it does actually tie into something I was going to mention. If I kind of move to, I would say one of the influential authors on me in this past year has been an author by the name of Louis Markos. And he's written a series of books. I'm not sure when they came out, but I just discovered them. But, the first one I read was The Myth Made Fact. It's kind of playing off a cute C. S. Lewis quote. <Okay, yeah.> So, he really espouses this idea that there's a lot that we can learn as Christians, and take from Greek culture, the Greek myths, the Greek heroes, right? And so I've really appreciated his book, The Myth Made Fact.

 He wrote a second one called From Plato to Christ, which kind of links Greek philosophy to Christian thinking. And I am [00:16:00] about to finish one called From Achilles to Christ, which really links these Greek heroes to, he would say, almost a precursory understanding of the Christian faith. And, that may all sound weird, but when you read his books, he really gives you permission, and he's a evangelical seminary professor somewhere, but he really gives you permission to actually see these as laying the groundwork for the Christian faith. And the way it ties into what you just said is, I would say, you know, you talked about Baal and Ashtoreth and Moloch, it's almost like this progression downward, right? <Right, yeah.> Well, he almost sees the Greek culture and the Greek myths and the Greek heroes as a progression toward the Christian faith. So it's almost kind of the opposite. That's why I say there's a bit of a tie in here. 

And so I've just really enjoyed almost someone from the Christian [00:17:00] realm, a Christian thinker, almost giving permission to embrace and study Greek philosophy, Greek mythology, and actually see these as pointers to Christ. <Yeah.> Not standing in opposition, <Yeah.> righ? To the Christian faith, which a lot of times it's how it's presented. 

J.R.: Well, I'm glad you said that: gives you permission. Because one of the things we've said on who knows how many podcasts we've had to, we have to kind of put our own disclaimer and say, we're not saying, we're not saying that we don't believe that this part of the Bible isn't true or something. You know, we've had these conversations. But yeah, the, idea, and I think you're right about the Greek mythology, you said that it helps you understand the Old Testament and I would go a step further and say, without understanding Greek mythology, you miss a large amount of what the Old Testament It's trying to tell you.

David: Yeah, mythology in general, if you, 

J.R.: Yeah, yeah, I shouldn't - yes, [00:18:00] that's right. 

David: Yes. But yes, an understanding of mythology almost as a genre helps you understand some of what you're reading in the Old Testament. Again, my gut reaction is start to go now, disclaimer, disclaimer, but like, we'll probably move away from that. I think we kind of made ourselves clear on that. But yes, it does. It helps in your understanding of what you're reading. 

J.R.: Yeah, absolutely. So you're saying this guy gives you permission to do that, which is well said. Yeah. Yeah, you need to send me that book. 

David: Yeah, I'll send it your way. Yeah. It's something I would, it was a road I was going down anyway, kind of reading more of Plato, really fascinated by mythology because of, you know, our Greece trip. So it was kind of refreshing to run across an author who just said, yeah, man, totally embrace this. And, help it strengthen your faith. And really, the origins of where he's coming from reach back to guys like G. K. Chesterton, C. S. Lewis, who, that's what they did. Right. And we kind of forget that [00:19:00] aspect of what they were doing, but that's exactly what Chesterton and C.S. Lewis were doing as well. 

J.R.: Right, they both had roots in romantic languages and mythology. And, they both had roots in medieval literature and you know, you can kind of see where they pull a lot of their views from. And when we read Chesterton and, or at least when I read Chesterton and Lewis, I'm thinking, man, how in the world do they come up with this brilliant insight on something that I've read a hundred times and never got that right? You know, and so much of it, I think you're right, I think it's right. I think it's from their deep understanding of medieval literature and mythology. 

David: Yeah, they were into it. They studied it. You know, I mean, how do you think Lewis came up with the Narnia series and a lot, so much of that is just retelling Greek myths.

J.R.: Yeah, the hero's journey. 

David: Yeah, the hero's journey. And same thing with Chesterton. And so, yeah, I think Louis Markos has really helped me in a modern perspective, reach back to Lewis and [00:20:00] Chesterton who have reached back to the Greek myths and Greek philosophy and said, yeah, none of this has to stand at odds. You know, this can help actually strengthen your faith, strengthen what your understanding is of the Bible without it being in conflict. Right? <Right.> Now, it was an incomplete understanding. Let me say that. <Right.> It was an incomplete understanding, but it's what laid the groundwork for, really, the Greco Roman world eventually becoming so receptive to the Christian message, was because of that groundwork.

J.R.: Yeah, and that understanding just helps you understand the way ancients communicated in general. <Right, yeah.> And so, okay, so Louis Markos, right? <Yes.> I said send me the book, but then I realized you download, you do ebooks, and so. <Yeah.> I'm just gonna have to download to my Kindle. I'm just gonna have to pony up the money.

David: I'm sure there's a way, ahh, to share ebooks and I, I've read [00:21:00] about some ways you've got to like remove it from your library and, but you've got to also have a version that you can send to someone. But it's the whole point is they make it a pain to actually share, but that is one of the downsides. 

J.R.: Yeah. Some of our listeners out there are thinking, dude, it's so easy. All you got to do is, yeah. So if you know how to bootleg this stuff, let us know, we'd love to know it. 

David: Or, or do it legally. Yeah. Yeah. We'd be open to that too. 

J.R.: Yeah. There you go.

David: Yeah. All right, so we talked about a couple of authors and books. What else? What else has influenced you in the past year? You got anything else you want to share?

Well, I'll jump in and say actually because I know this influenced both of us. But I think at the beginning of this year The Daily Wire released the Exodus series. <Oh, yeah.> Where Jordan Peterson, Jonathan Pageau, who were some of the other people? 

J.R.: Dennis Prager. 

David: Dennis Prager, yes. Oz Guinness. 

J.R.: Oz Guinness, yeah.

David: I mean, these are like pretty big thinkers. Greg Hurwitz, which I enjoyed Hurwitz coming in.

J.R.: Yeah, I've, I had never heard of him before [00:22:00] until, until this series and I really, I started looking him up. Is he the the Hollywood. 

David: He was in Hollywood, I guess he's written a bunch of novels he produces movie, video, things like that.

J.R.: But he really has a good grip on understanding narrative.

David: Right, yeah. 

J.R.: On the rise and fall of narrative. Yeah, and he pulled that in several times, and I thought he was really interesting. No, I'm glad you brought that up, because Exodus seems like, well, it was at the beginning of the year, so it was a good ways back. But man, that is such a fantastic series. 

David: Yeah, really just an extra - seeing these I would say great minds people who have influenced me and, just to see that very different perspective mix with the traditional perspectives of someone like an Oz Guinness just sit there and talk about all the stories in Exodus and all the different ways you can read it. Yeah, that's, that's like, just watching them, so. 

J.R.: I know, and these guys come from such diverse backgrounds and disciplines and they brought their own [00:23:00] educated understanding to reading the Exodus story is kind of a neat format to have these. You know, it wasn't a round table of different pastors and preachers. <Right.> I mean, it was philosophers and psychiatrists and like I said, Hollywood narrative writers and pastors. And they all bring what they understand to the table. And when you see that, when you see all that overlaid, what it kind of, well, what it showed me is that, man, there are so many layers to how to read the Bible.

You know, if anybody says, here's how you should read the Bible, well, just, that's a big red flag, move on, you know, because there's so many different layers. 

David: One of 50 ways, yeah. 

J.R.: Exactly, you know, and they kind of like you said, they gave me permission to open up a new layer an understanding that it doesn't undo my previous understanding of the Exodus story or something like that, but it does give me another layer, another lens to add to it.

And you see that, man, this is so multifaceted these ancient biblical stories. [00:24:00] And when you have guys like that, these brilliant guys from different disciplines breaking that story down, that's where you can really see it and think, wow, this is not, you know, John Grisham. This is, this is something so much deeper and so much more profound. You know what I mean? It's, this is not just a good tale. This is something that has so many layers and so many facets, and I really appreciated what they tackled and pulled out of it.

David: Yeah, and I'll tack on one more thing to what you just said, which is when you see these super smart people, actually coming from different perspectives, and actually having some argument and disagreement over how should I read this portion. Man, it makes me go back and say, okay, here's the way to read this, I probably need to back up, and there's probably ten different ways to read it read it. But I just really appreciate the back and forth, the disagreement, the different perspectives, and it, yeah. Similar to something you said earlier in this podcast is, yeah, it makes me want to go back and read other parts of the [00:25:00] Bible because I'm certain that I've missed a ton of stuff in certain parts of the Bible.

J.R.: Yeah. And, and I think you're right. I think it kind of, that really did, now that I think about it, that kind of launched 2023 for me. And that's sort of that journey that I've been going on, is that rereading the Bible. I have a renewed interest in the Bible that I haven't had in a long time.

David: That's awesome.

J.R.: And yeah, so much of it is because of these different facets and way of viewing something. 

David: Yeah. Yeah. And frankly, you know, we try and bring a little bit of that to this podcast. And <Sure.> before that Exodus series even came out you know, that's kind of what we envisioned at a very, very, very small scale. Not nearly the brain power of a table like that, but . But yeah,

J.R.: Well, how long, it's like 16 hours. Oh yeah. I forget what it was. Maybe longer than that. Yeah. But 16 episodes, two hours a piece, so yeah, 30 hours of this stuff. So yeah, we're not going into that depth, but ...

David: Yeah. Alright. So yeah, what else? Anything else? Anything like, I don't know, Netflix or [00:26:00] YouTube or 

J.R.: Netflix. You don't want to know what I watch on Netflix. 

David: Okay. 

J.R.: I just finished A Small Light. Very good. It's about the Holocaust. It's kind of 

David: A Small Light. Yeah, what is that?

J.R.: Yeah, it's worth seeing. It is the Holocaust story. The Anne Frank story, but it's not, Anne Frank is in it, but it's not told from her perspective. It's told from the perspective of Meep, I forget her last name. But basically the woman that hid the Frank family in her attic, you know, and was instrumental in that. So it's kind of a different angle on the Anne Frank story. It was fantastic. Man, it was really good. <Okay.> So yeah, check that one out. That was good. uh, it doesn't really tie into our podcast anyway, but it's a great story. 

David: No, that's all right. The series that I'm working my way through. I don't know if you've seen this. I really, and again, this doesn't really tie into our podcast or have any deep theological meaning, but ...

J.R.: Wait a second, is it in foreign language? <No.> You always suggest these Netflix series that have subtitles or ...

David: I do. I could suggest a couple of good foreign [00:27:00] films that I really, truly enjoyed, and actually kind of the whole mythology theme. But I won't get into that because that's gonna be a ...

J.R.: I'm probably missing something, but I just can't do it. Says I'll pull it up and I'll think, Oh man, this has subtitles. I can't do this. 

David: Okay. Yeah, you're eliminating a bunch of good TV, all of a sudden. 

J.R.: I know. No, I just don't have that artistic vein, I guess. Okay. I interrupted. Go ahead. 

David: Well, so one of the themes of shows that I like has to do with, and it kind of sounds morbid at first, but it has to do with the whole idea of the Middle Eastern world and kind of the modern war on terrorism. 

J.R.: Yeah, sure. 

David: And just the reason is because, not just from the terrorism aspect, again, you know, that's a whole different thing, but the understanding of a vastly different culture and understanding the inner workings and you know how it does intersect on our trips every now and then. My favorite example of this is it's gonna be one of those shows that I just talked about. It's good. It's Fauda, right? <Okay. Yeah.> Voiceover, you know, it's [00:28:00] Israeli show, but absolutely ...

J.R.: At least it's in English. I can handle overdub. 

David: fantastic <Yeah.> insight into that world. But as I try to find more series one of the ones that kept coming up is Homeland have you ever watched Homeland?

J.R.: Homeland. Yeah Claire Danes, I think. Is that right? I saw that several, yeah, I saw it several years ago. I don't, I don't know if I got through the first season. How many seasons? 

David: I was surprised there were eight seasons. I've never watched it. I've heard about it a ton. You know, anytime you Google, you know, shows on Middle Eastern affairs, terrorism, things like that. Homeland is always up there with Fauda and, so, but I was like, okay, I'm gonna watch this. 

J.R.: Well, it's worth binging now, is what was, is the point. 

David: And I was surprised to, to see eight seasons. I'm like, okay, I got a lot of episodes to catch up on. 

J.R.: No, but that's what I like to see because probably the reason I stopped watching it is because I had to wait week to week for the next episode and it just doesn't fit into my, to the way I consume media now, I guess. <Okay.> I have to binge it. So yeah, that'll be worth watching. But it kind of ties in. I mean, [00:29:00] listen, when Hamas is making headlines, and terrorism is making headlines. There's sort of a Western view that wants to get your head wrapped around - what drives that mentality?

You know, who goes in and does these things? And we want to kind of understand terrorism. And I think it's overly simplistic in the West to sort of paint it as simple good versus evil. And I'm not saying that there's not an aspect of that going on. But yeah, you you're saying that both of these shows probably give you a little bit deeper understanding of the culture that drives that.

David: They're, they're a bit more nuanced than simply, hey, America is going to go win the war on terror. Like it's a bit more nuanced than that. It shows kind of the pitfalls, the tensions you know, the moral conundrums. 

J.R.: Yeah. They hate us because of our freedom, right? 

David: Yeah, yeah. 

J.R.: A little bit deeper than that.

David: Yeah, so I've enjoyed that. I think I'm in season 5 right now. But the other, you know, Claire Danes, you said Claire Danes, she's the main [00:30:00] character. I like her character because she's very good at what she does. She's also a very flawed individual in her personal life. And so you always see kind of this tension between all of her many flaws, her demons. <Yeah, yeah.> but, you know, her ability to then go do what she does you know, what she's gifted at, I guess you would say. But yeah, I'm, I'm enjoying that show, again not overly spiritual.

J.R.: Okay. I'm going to put it on my list. I'll queue it up. 

David: Yeah, I'm enjoying it. Yeah. And it's one of those too - like, Fauda is kind of a condensed version of it - but it's one of those too where every, every time you watch an episode or two and you think, eh, it's getting a little slow, like something big happens and you just think, oh, wow, you know, they just went there or I just watched that happen on, you know. So yeah, enjoying that, so.

J.R.: Okay, better than Breaking Bad or no? 

David: You're gonna get mad at me. I never could finish Breaking Bad. 

J.R.: Oh, I can't believe that.

David: I know, you know. Well, I lost I think I I lost my Netflix sign in and had to re sign in and then I like lost [00:31:00] actually where I was. And I was like okay, I'm not going to. 

J.R.: So you were stealing Netflix from somebody else and they crack down on it.

David: No, that's not it.

J.R.: That's not how you roll? 

David: No, that's not. Anyway. 

J.R.: It's how my kids roll. And both of them, both of them had called me and said, what's the deal with Netflix? I'm like, dude, they're cracking down there. You know, I don't know what to tell you.

David: You mean that thing you don't pay for? <Yeah. Yeah.> I did that actually with Spotify. So I just called you a couple of weeks ago. What's the deal with Spotify? Cause I'm on your family plan. 

J.R.: Yeah. Yeah. Now that is, that's straight up. That's legal. 

David: Yeah. Yeah. Okay. 

J.R.: But no, that was a identity theft card situation that I had to update. So I apologize if I messed up your, your Joe Rogan. 

David: No, well, it made me realize how much I enjoy Spotify. And if you said, Hey, I got to drop you from my plan, you know, I would say, all right, I've got to go subscribe myself, so. 

J.R.: Okay. So 2024, you'll get the family plan and just send me the link? Is that, is that what I hear? 

David: No, we'll edit that out. This conversation [00:32:00] never happens. 

J.R.: There you go.

David: Yeah. All right. Well, 

J.R.: All right. So yeah, where are we going this year then? 

David: Yeah. Season 2. Let's do a quick overview of where we think we're headed. Always subject to change, but yeah, season 2.

So we're gonna start out, earlier in the season is more set, but we're gonna start out with an overview of Philippians. And I have to say, the reason why is because, God willing, I'm gonna finish up formatting and editing and all that. 

J.R.: I was gonna say, I thought you were done. 

David: And, well, the text. But yeah, I have a book coming out called A Journey Through Philippi.

J.R.: Right. And you and I went there. 

David: You and I went there, so there's a bunch of angles here. A little bit to, do a little bit of that promotion for the release of that book. But yeah, you and I went there, we have a lot of insights. And we did this with Colossians last season. <Right.> that I really enjoyed.

In fact, one of the things I said is that, man, I wish I could go back and add things to that book, A Journey Through Colossae, that I also wrote <Right.> after our discussions, right? [00:33:00] So. Yeah. But yeah, so we're gonna talk about the big themes in each of the four chapters in the book of Philippians. It's gonna tie into our time there. It's gonna tie into the book. So, I think that'll be good.

J.R.: Yeah, yeah, that'll be fun.

David: A couple other series that we're gonna tackle there's a couple of episodes that we're gonna talk about this idea of what is truth. 

J.R.: Oh, yeah, yeah, I'm actually, I'm looking forward to that. And just, our casual conversations on that, you gave me kind of an outline of it, and I thought, no, this is great, I love this. So, yeah, I'm looking forward to that one. 

David: Yeah, one of those topics where I kind of did some thinking and some outlining and you and I talked and you've added to it and, yeah, it's one of these things where I'm like, alright, we just need to do a couple of episodes on this idea of what is truth. So we'll tackle that. 

J.R.: Sometimes yeah, sometimes things are like so what fundamental and foundational that it's difficult to describe because we all think that everyone knows what a word or idea means and truth is one of the, or good, you know, what does good mean?

You know, if I talk about a [00:34:00] good movie, well, I think you know what that means. But, you know, , the bigger picture of what truth means, what good means. Yeah, I think this is necessary. I think it's I think it'll be really helpful. 

David: Yeah, it's helped me personally because I agree with that, truth tends to be one of those things you say, well, Look, it's either true or not, right? The Bible talks about one truth, and it's maybe a little more nuanced than that. So, we'll talk about that.

J.R.: I could run down this road right now, but let's save it. 

David: All right, let's move on then before we have a whole episode right in the middle of this one, so. <Yeah.> And another series that we actually kind of brought up is, so, the book of Judges, right? So, there's a way of understanding the Book of Judges, and you and I, we've had a lot of conversations recently offline about this, and so it's another one of these things that's like, all right, let's just do a series. Let's talk about the judges. How to understand that little book that sits in the middle of, the Torah, Joshua, the conquests of the land, and, you know, [00:35:00] Samuel, Chronicles, that really gets into the Israelite monarchy, things like that. <Right.> There's this little, really weird book of Judges. Right? 

J.R.: Yeah. Yeah. And, and all of us know stories about Samson. 

David: We know the stories, sure. 

J.R.: Some of the stories, but, overall, it's, it, you're right, it's a complicated book. And there's, there's several strange passages in there. You're like, man, they didn't teach me that in Sunday school. <Yeah.> So yeah, we'll, dissect some of those. I, yeah, I'm looking forward to that one as well. 

David: Yeah. Rolling into the fall and this becomes more subject to change, but I want to do a series on the gospel announcement. What is the gospel? And there's several aspects of that idea. Again, one of those things that you go, well, yeah, we know what the gospel is, right? You know, accept Jesus as your personal Lord and Savior. But it's much more nuanced than that. You know, I've learned a lot from understanding that this idea of gospel is not unique to Christianity. It's kind of [00:36:00]borrowed. Yeah, it's kind of borrowed from Greek and Roman idea. In fact, there's this very Roman idea of what the gospel is.

J.R.: Okay, see, sounds like you're being controversial again. 

David: Maybe, yeah. So, you know, what's the gospel? What's the context? Things like, what does it mean to reign with God? Are we going to heaven? You know, what does heaven mean? So we'll get into that. That's going to be a good series. Yeah. 

J.R.: Okay. Yeah. That sounds interesting to me too.

David: And then we just, I've just added this in during our pre conversation here. Yeah, let's talk a little bit more about a couple of Stranger Things ideas, right? 

J.R.: Hey, in this day and time, there's always strange things popping up, so. 

David: Plenty of material when it comes to Stranger Things, right? 

J.R.: Oh, yeah, no doubt. So we can talk about, yeah, we talked about virtual reality and some other things. Yeah, well, I love those conversations. Yeah. They're fun. 

David: So we'll kind of do a part two. Maybe that'll be an annual thing. 

J.R.: Yeah, okay. That sounds good.

David: Stranger things. 

J.R.: Strange things from 2024. 

David: [00:37:00] Right. And then at the very end, we plan to wrap up. And again, this is God willing, and I'm putting some pressure on you here. But we've been talking about going back to Greece. 

J.R.: Oh, definitely.

David: So, there is a placeholder for the last several episodes of, now that we've been once, I, I think we can do some episodes more on the fly. We know a little bit more about the content we'd like to do, but if we go to Greece next October, which is what we've been talking about we will obviously have three or four episodes around observations, you know, our travels, bring you insights from where we go. So that's ...

J.R.: Yeah, no, you don't have to twist my arm on that. That's all right. Good. I'm down for that. So let's, yeah. Let's book it. 

David: And you know me. I'm already like planning. I'm already booking hotels and got an itinerary.

J.R.: Well, you make it easy. All I do is just say, look, man, how much do I need to Venmo you? And then what airport do I need to be at on what day? You usually take care of all that stuff. So that's very convenient. 

David: Yeah. No, I was, I always throw some stuff together and it's like, all [00:38:00] right, you know, here's a chance for your input. You're like, nope, just tell me what flight to board. 

J.R.: Exactly. Yeah. Yup. And then I hit a Trip Advisor and throw some, throw some things out there.

David: Yeah. Well, so that's an overview of season two. Again, that's subject to change. We always might run into something that's particularly a burning issue or on our minds. So always subject to, you know, switch some things around, but that's, where we're kind of headed in season two and I'm excited about it.

J.R.: Yeah, I can't wait. That'll be fun. Yeah, I'm sure we have plenty of other rabbit trails to go down. 

David: More rabbit trails to explore. 

J.R.: Yeah, yeah, exactly. All right. So here we go. We'll kick it off. 

David: Yeah, we will start in a couple of weeks. Well, in the virtual world, I guess we'll start with Philippians. We'll start recording that. But we'll also have some different ways we've been talking about of how to get you as the audience more involved. So we'll be talking about some of those too as we kick off the Philippians series. But yeah, [00:39:00] like to hear more of your input, more of your topics, and we want to make it easier for you to chime in. We'll be taking maybe some questions. 

J.R.: Yeah, yeah, Q& A thing would be fun. 

David: Yeah, yeah, so as always, Navigating An Ancient Faith, our website. Obviously the podcast, the Facebook group, that's the way to contact us. But we'll make it easier as well in coming episodes about how to discuss all that and yeah, thanks for listening.

J.R.: Here we go. That sounds good. We'll see y'all next week. ´